ST. LOUIS 鈥 Robert Cardillo is even more confident now that he made the right choice four years ago to build the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency鈥檚 new western headquarters in north St. Louis.
Cardillo retired as director of the National Geospatial-Intelligence agency a year ago, took a role as a distinguished fellow at St. Louis University鈥檚 GeoSLU initiative, and is advising the GeoFutures planning effort intended to establish the region as a hub of geospatial talent.
Now a private consultant, Cardillo sat down with the Post-Dispatch last week after a lecture in the Cortex tech district. The interview has been edited for length and clarity.
Q: So how much time do you spend in St. Louis now?
A: Two, three days a month, which is interesting because it鈥檚 a little bit more than I did as director. I mean, the unwritten rule being the director of NGA is when you weren鈥檛 in St. Louis on a month, they noticed.
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So I came out last night, had a nice dinner with (co-founder of Square and tech training nonprofit LaunchCode) Jim McKelvey, just catching up with Launch Code. Last time I was out here I was with (Kelvin) Adams, superintendent of St. Louis Public Schools.
The reason I want to stay connected to St. Louis is to help grow and develop the ecosystem. For two reasons. One, I鈥檓 still attached to NGA, always will be. I think the more successful St. Louis and the region can be the more successful that campus will be. And two, after you know, having traveled here now for close to 30 years, I鈥檓 attached. And I鈥檇 love to be part of this, what I think is a wonderful opportunity.
A lot of my life is trying to help companies get new business.
This is a city lift, which is exciting to be a part of.
Q: How important is developing that GeoFutures plan?
A: The city, region had a vision: Let鈥檚 become the global center of excellence on research about things that come out of the dirt and grow, and then we will be experts in plants, fertilization, hybridization. (The plant science focus) has been enormously successful.
So I鈥檝e been working with Jason Hall at Arch to Park as they emulate 鈥 I mean, it鈥檚 not exactly the same 鈥 but put together a (geospatial) plan that as I understand will be rolled out here in March.
It won鈥檛 be a micro detail, Company A do this, Government B, do that. But at least a way to unify and create coherence across everyone鈥檚 efforts. It can鈥檛 be SLU alone. We have to have Washington University. We have to have Harris-Stowe. We have to have UMSL, St. Louis Community College.
Q: Do you still feel confident in your decision to place the NGA north of downtown?
A: I am more confident today than I was four years ago. I think the city and the region and the actors have really stepped up. And now that I have time to decompress and meet more people, I have found more justification for that location.
Let me quickly say, this is not a done deal, OK? Drive over by Jefferson and Cass (avenues), you see a big fence, right? And you might see some bulldozers on the other side. But that neighborhood is still a 鈥渢o-be鈥 neighborhood. My advice to all my colleagues here is no coasting, right? We collectively have got to work really hard.
I鈥檓 not saying this just for NGA. There鈥檚 a much broader commercial, academic, institutional, civic upside if the city and the region does this right.
Q: Surely, the same sort of interest from the private sector must be going on near the headquarters in Washington?
A: You鈥檇 be surprised. Part of the challenge though in D.C. is because of where we are: It鈥檚 a government installation on a military post. It鈥檚 hard to get there. Now, trust me, we will have a secure (St. Louis) facility. It鈥檒l be protected. You will see guards at the new campus and all that. But, as I鈥檝e heard (current NGA Director Vice Admiral Robert Sharp) say, 20% of it is going to be dedicated open. Don鈥檛 think open means insecure, but open to tech startups, to unclassified capability, you don鈥檛 have to have a clearance.
It鈥檚 just a different model than the campus in the east, and that鈥檚 not a hit on the campus in the east. The campus in the east was built at a different time with kind of a different mentality about what that relationship should be with the outside world. This one is being built from the ground up knowing that we鈥檝e got to have a tight relationship with our neighbors. And I mean that in every sense of it, so literally the citizens but also businesses and companies, schools, all of that.
Q: What鈥檚 your vision for 20 years from now?
A: I would hope you鈥檇 see groups of students crossing a pedestrian walkway over Jefferson Avenue, coming onto the campus to take a class or see a demo. Yes, I hope there鈥檚 a brewery nearby.
St. Louis鈥檚 history is St. Louis鈥 history. It鈥檚 been uneven to say the least with respect to race, equality and fairness. NGA is going to a part of town that鈥檚 part of that history. Pruitt-Igoe is right next door. I did not pick that site as some sort of exchange for the past. That site selection was all about the future, OK.
Having said that, now we鈥檝e got an opportunity, we collectively have an opportunity to kind of rewrite our future. So how inclusive can we be? How open can we be? How welcoming can we be to represent the country, the state the city by looking like the country, the state the city?
Yes, there should be a Starbucks and Dunkin鈥 Donuts and some hipster coffee shop that is independently owned. The singular reason I put the campus there was because I thought it was the best place we could succeed in our future mission, period. And I also do think that the way our society is going is that more of the talent will want to live close to work.
Q: People bring up the Obama administration policy of building in urban areas. How much did that play into the decision?
A: Zero. And I know, look, people can say what they鈥檙e gonna say, but in this case, there was one decision-maker. There was no committee. I got lots of advice. Nobody leaned on me, no one hinted. Nothing.
Q: How have the rank-and-file responded?
A: I won鈥檛 kid you. There wasn鈥檛 a standing ovation. Look, the first town hall I had after my announcement at (western headquarters) on Second Street was tense.
I get it. I worked in southeast Washington before Nationals Park went in. This was 40 years ago.
But, look, I think on balance now, especially with the workforce that is newer 鈥 not always younger, but newer 鈥 there鈥檚 an excitement.
Have you visited Second Street? I get it that it鈥檚 鈥渟afe鈥 in some ways, but there鈥檚 a chemical plant, a train yard. There鈥檚 a lot of danger around there, it鈥檚 just different danger. Plus, it鈥檚 a depressing facility 鈥 it鈥檚 basically windowless.
If I was working there, I would have this reaction about, oh my goodness, can I be safe? Will I be safe? But then I would say, imagine how I could do my mission, better, faster, etc.
So I don鈥檛 have polling statistics, but my sense is, there鈥檚 kind of a palpable positive anxiety. There鈥檚 two kinds of anxiety. The negative kind. Yep, that exists, I鈥檓 sure.
But I think the bulk of it is turning positive.